lovinlaces birmans review: two kittens died in 6 years,fip 7

I think that when prospective buyers/adopters of kittens see "FELV and FIV tested" they then think that a breeder has covered the bases and is offering a kitten from a program that has bred out diseases that can be carried in DNA. But FIP is different. So that gets into some practices by breeders that can be called into question: like allowing a stud male to go outdoors. I know of a former breeder who, years ago, allowed this to happen with a very popular Birman sire. A good reputation among other breeders is a good way to go when looking for breeders of the breed of your choice. Attending CFA and TICA cat shows is one way to get to know the breeders and find out those breeders whom they trust. The guarantees that are available are a good thing for a potential buyer or adopter. However, depending upon what is guaranteed and for how long, some diseases don't become apparent for years, so if you can find out what a breeder's cat (or a shelter's cat) has died from, then you have another piece of the puzzle. For example, if a shelter kitten dies soon from distemper, you have to wonder about whether several litters have been exposed to each other, how clean the premises are, and so forth. All in all, for purebreds I think you find out which breeders have the best reputations among their peers.

I am sorry to hear of another Birman kitten loss. You did not say where this kitten came from, so I think it is fair to point out that this loss should not be laid at Tippi's doorstep. You did say "Lovin Laces take note", but that is not the same as saying Tippi sold you the kitten. If she is the breeder of your kitten, then I am sorry that lightening struck twice. But mostly I am sorry for you & your kitty. Please let me respond to what you said about it being a breeder's responsibility to warn the owner that the kitten could die. May I put it into perspective? Any person that you get a kitten or a puppy from will behave in the same manner as the breeder of your kitten did. They (pet shops, shelters, genuine show-breeders, backyard breeders, people outside of Wal-Mart with a box of free puppies or kittens) will place a pet with you with with a smile on their face & a hope in their heart that all will be well. No one is going to warn you the obvious, that what is "alive" will sooner or later be "not alive". It is the chance we all take in life. Imagine saying on someone's wedding day that they hope it will not end in divorce. Where there is a wedding, there is always the possibility of a divorce, yet no one ever warns the bridal couple of that. It is because people want to put their best foot forward. Certainly that includes the joyous moment that a new pet comes into your life. The shelter, breeder, person outside of Wal-Mart are the same. They hope for a long, happy life for the pet that they put into your arms. Life does not come with warnings or guarantees. Perhaps you are under the impression that Birmans from breeders, even good ones, are more likely to die from FIP or whatever, than are cats from the shelter. They are not. Any cat who has been exposed to the ubiqitous Coronavirus which causes FIP can come down with it due to a failure of their own immune systems. It is not the breeder's fault, it is not the shelter's fault and it is not the fault of the person outside of Wal-Mart with the box of free kittens. After having told you that I disagree that it is the breeder's fault that your kitten died without warning, let me give you some good news. You do not need to hover over your other cats just waiting in dread for them to die! The reason is that they have already been exposed (as you point out), having come from a concentrated colony of cats (as do cattery cats AND shelter cats) and they have resisted getting sick so far. It is very unlikely at this point that they will succumb to FIP, because it is the nature of the disease to strike the very young who have immature immune systems. Let me suggest to any one out there who wants to decrease the liklihood of FIP that they consider a full grown adult instead. Again, please accept my condolences on your lost kitten, but at the same time, please let me also make you aware that no one who raises animals (or, I suppose, children, for that matter), has any intention of having their beloved one die an untimely death. In life there are no guarantees. Only hopes for the best. Thank you for reading & considering my words.

I too lost a kitten to FIP ten days after he arrived with us. Were devastated and our hearts still ache for him - it would have been his first birthday tomorrow. Our vet told us that he would have had the virus when we came to us. Whilst I agree with some of what sepiasister says in that there is no controlling a virus, the fact remains that breeders do not alert new kitten owners to the potential devastation of FIP and that their cats carry the virus. The issue is that colonies of cats, typical of a breeder's, tend to pass the virus around the group so that it is never free of infection. That's the point. They are knowingly selling a kitten in the knowledge that it could die. There is no point offering another kitten as that too will carry the virus. Who would want another infected kitten and then wait out its life to see whether it's going to die or not. What I will never forgive the breeder we got our kitten from and whom did not tell us that her cats were infected, is that our two other Birmans are also now infected with coronavirus. Whether it develops into FIP, who knows but that's the threat we have hanging over us for the rest of their lives now. Any reputable breeder would retire before they allowed that to happen as a result of continuing to sell kittens that they knew were likely to be infected. Lovinlaces take note.

I am sad to read about the FIP losses, but I am also dismayed to see a fellow Birman breeder maligned like this. I think that this complaint against her is unfair. FIP happens. Tippi did not cause it. I am proud of her, as a fellow Birman breeder, that she replaced the kitten. She did exactly what is expected of a quality breeder. It is a very sad coincidence that the replacement kitten also died of FIP, but again, that is not Tippi's fault. We breeders cannot control FIP. We do our best to produce happy, healthy kittens. The only thing that we can do when this happens is to offer a replacement kitten. ALL cattery cats have been exposed to FIP, so changing breeders is NOT going to solve the problem. Same with shelter cats ... ALL have been exposed to the coronavirus that causes FIP. It is up to the individual cat's immune system as to how it responds to the viral challenge. Better minds than mine have been working in laboratories for years trying to solve the FIP problem. I fear that we are still years & years away from a solution. It is simply not within us breeders' ability to prevent FIP. There is not a definitive test for FIP, there are only a cluster of laboratory findings that can merely suggest that an illness "is compatible with" FIP. Not even after a thorough necropsy (animal autopsy) is performed will a laboratory take upon itself to declare that FIP is certain. Again, what you will find is a statement that says cause of death "is compatible with" FIP. Breeders cannot prevent losses from FIP, nor can we predict WHICH ones are going to die of FIP. We dread phonecalls from bereaved kitten buyers saying they have lost a cat to FIP, because not only do we grieve for the particular cat involved, but we double grieve for the pain it has brought the loving owner, to whom we have sold the cat, in addition. Any quality breeder will do what Tippi did, by offering a replacement kitten. But please do remember that once a kitten has left our house, we cannot control the circumstances under which it lives, and replacing a kitten is a kindness that we feel obliged to do, even though we did not cause the fatality. FIP just happens & all the good will in the world will not prevent it. I am especially sad for people who lose a beloved pet to FIP, but I ask you to please cut this breeder a break. She is also a victim in this incident of FIP loss. Her heart aches too. She should not be punished for an act of nature. Truly, really, all we can do is to grieve & then move on.

I am sorry to hear that you lost your kitten. Coronavirus is a benign virus which causes colds in humans ( human specific) bovine, dogs the list goes on. Coronavirus itself is not deadly, BUT if a kitten has a compromised immune system it can turn to FIP, which can NOT be confirmed on a living animal. The only test to confirm a kitten has Coronavirus is a fecal or one derived directly from body cavitie fluids confirmed via PCR DNA/RNA test, that test alone does NOT confirm FIP, simply that the cat has been in contact with the Coronavirus and is shedding it, please note the coronavirus is not one single virus it is several different strains of a cold: type of virus umbrellaed under the name Caronavirus, which is why any antigen or DNA/RNA test can not quantify a predisposition to FIP or confirm FIP, as only 1 strain can turn into FIP, unless the aforementioned mutate to FIP. It is estimated nearly half of all domestic felines will have some sort of positive result if tested for Corona Virus, with varying numbers greater than that in catteries or high number households and rescues. The FIP itself is not what kills a cat or kitten it is the kitten or cats bodies immune systems overreaction which causes death, which cannot be predicted.

While you should of received a healthy kitten from the start, it is more than probable that this kitten was positive for Coronavirus, and it mutated while in your care, and highly unlikely that it had mutated prior as it is not a spontaneous event. Unless you had your vet do a thorough exam and testing within the first few days in which you had the kitten for DNA/RNA status of Coronavirus.

Ideally one would hope that every precautionary test has been run on her cats, and her kittens, but because of the elusive and unpinpointed nature of the Coronavirus(s) there is little protocol besides hygiene that can eradicate it in the breeding environment. It is imperative of any kitten buyer to do their due diligence when they buy a kitten, both before and after acquiring their kitten, responsibility alone does not soley fall on the breeder as once the kitten leaves they cannot control a mutation or a particular strain of virus from changing, as they themselves are not god. In turn if they have had a kitten who had any form of URI prior to placement, I believe it should be disclosed to the buyer, so they may make an informed decision.

If you are getting another kitten, who ends up dieing of FIP, it simply means their immune systems are compromised which can be linked to their genetics, but is not attached to them genetically, as the Coronavirus(s) can be avoided to pass between the positive parents to kittens.

I ran across this by accident while checking my web page. I urge anyone who has ever gotten a kitten from me to call or e-mail as soon as there is a problem such as the kitten/cat's reduction in appetite or activity. I also have a health guarantee against any congenital problems including FIP which may or may not be congenital. I always respond to e-mails and phone calls. FIP is a complex disease. I understand that people who lose a kitten are hurt and angry, and if it happens to them twice from the same cattery, it is a natural response to blame the breeder. I have been breeding cfa registered birmans for 19 years. If FIP is genetically connected as the experts seem to think, I would like to know details about the cats symptoms and test results as well as disease progression so that I know what sire and dam are involved, so that they may be spayed or neutered. Also, it has come to my attention that some vets are using prednisone or a steroid to stimulate appetite. Since FIP affects the immune system, a steroid that depletes the immune system ultimately will hurt rather than help a cat affected by FIP. This is why I urge people to call or write if there's a health problem.

We also lost a cat to FIP that we got from Lovinlaces in 2010. She replaced him and now a year later this one is also showing signs of FIP. He goes in Saturday for the second vet visit. I do not have a good feeling. My kids are crushed as am I.