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Legacy Builders USA

Legacy Builders USA review: Roofing Ripoffs 35

J
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2:40 pm EDT
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This company is worst company on the planet. DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR INSURANCE MONEY. They have this ploy where they tell you to "sign a contingency contract" and that they will go get your money for you. You sign a contract NOT for a dollar amount, but for what they call "RCV". That means that every penny of your insurance money goes to them and you have absolutely no say as to where the money is spent or how. The reason why is because they also tell you that there will be "little or no money out of pocket". All the salespeople are trained to do this because clients let their guard down thinking they won't have to pay for the work at the end. NOT TRUE. Once the work is done they can legally put a lien on your home if you don't pay them everything that the insurance has alloted for the job PLUS 100% of your deductible. Don't get screwed. A word to the wise is sufficient.

Update by Joe Gautier
Jun 21, 2009 2:02 am EDT

Jon Paramore
President
Legacy Builders USA
Jon's St. Louis mobile: /removed/
Jon's Houston mobile: /removed/
Work e-mail: jonp@legacybuildersusa.com
St. Louis P.O. Box:
/removed/

Update by Joe Gautier
Jun 21, 2009 2:04 am EDT

Brian Routt
Supervisor
Legacy Builders
Houston mobile: /removed/
St. Louis mobile: /removed/
Work: brianr@legacybuildersusa.com
St. Louis: brian@routthomes.com

Update by Joe Gautier
Jun 21, 2009 2:32 am EDT

http://www.legacybuildersusa.com/contact.shtml

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35 comments
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Brent Clanton
Tom, US
Jul 29, 2009 6:25 pm EDT

Legacy Builders USA President Jon Paramor renegged on advertising contract, failing to provide adequate notice of cancellation and refusing to make final payment due as agreed. All subsequent attempts to collect have been ignored. Legacy Builders USA/Jon Paramore owes Clanton Communications $6, 060.00

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Blu-cigs
Saint Louis, US
Jan 13, 2014 10:26 pm EST

n case you wonder what these silly technical terms mean, CE4 is a type of atomizer that comes like any new plastic tube looking atomizers that you see everywhere now a days. This has some visible white strings(wick) on two sides which goes from around the top end to the core of the atomizer.
On the other hand the EVOD and T2 or T3 type atomizers look very similar in shape and material but looking closely you will see they do not have those white strings on either side, instead they may have a tiny cylinder looking long metal tube from top to bottom.
The way these two devices work are very different, the CE4 or similar type atomizers pulls the e Liquid through the long strings of wicks towards the top, while the EVOD type has these tiny but visible wicks that are at the base of the core where the heating elements are located. So in other words CE4 works pretty much the opposite way as the EVOD does. You fill the CE4 from the top while you fill the EVOD from the bottom holding it upside down.
The prices are very similar for both atomizers, you may find EVOD and T2 or T3 going for little higher (Average about $3-$5) when the CE4 average price is around $2-$3 depending on where you buy them from. Remember not all CE4 or EVOD are created equal. The quality, looks even shapes can vary widely along with price. There are over 400 e Cigarette manufacturers only in Shenzhen, China which also means there are at least that many variation in quality and looks. Since there are no set standards for these devices, every other company tries to get creative in designing and building these devices and they all have a mini R&D department in each factory.
I brought with me 7 different kinds of CE4 and around 9 different kind of EVOD/T2/T3 type atomizers when I was in China a month ago. I picked them from 4 different companies. To my surprise they did vary widely in every aspect. They did not even look exactly same, though with CE4 most of them had somewhat close similarities but the vaping experience was very different from one to the next. Out of 7 CE4 only 2 were decent and one was great. The rest didn’t create enough vapor to satisfy my thirst or gave me some burnt after taste. Remind you I used mostly pg based liquid as I remembered VG(thicker) type e liquid does even worse with these type of atomizers.
But surprisingly out of the 9 EVOD type atomizers 7 did great while the other 2 did okay but better than the best performing CE4. The best part of these atomizers are the way you can just change the core and it becomes all new again. These atomizers all have a core that is very easily changeable and they are cheap (Around $1.50-$2). If you use thicker VG based liquid that are darker in color than your core will not last more than a week. But if you use lighter color (Vg/PG mix), expect your atomizers to last about 2 weeks.
You can clean these cores by holding them under warm water for a few minutes while gently rub the wick part on each side to get the gunk out. Once you wash it, blow through them and shake them well so all the excess water of out than leave them around the window so they can dry for a day or two. This works well and gives them an extra week of life, but in my testing you can only wash them once or at most twice, after than the quality of vapor goes downhill.
One important reminder about battery cleaning, make sure to clean and dry the battery thread and inside the thread as 99% atomizers do leak a little juice here and there. For safety and for best vaping experience always clean the battery thread and inner side of the thread, in my experience Q tips work wonder. Make sure to clean them before you put them in charge and clean them each time you refill those cartomizers and atomizers. Enjoy and try the different E-Cig type of atomizers!
I would love your feedback and thoughts. Please post your advice and comments as it will help me improve this blog.

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lolllllllll
Clayton, US
Jan 09, 2014 4:41 pm EST
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E Cig
, US
Nov 18, 2013 7:46 pm EST

In case you wonder what these silly technical terms mean, CE4 is a type of atomizer that comes like any new plastic tube looking atomizers that you see everywhere now a days. This has some visible white strings(wick) on two sides which goes from around the top end to the core of the atomizer.
On the other hand the EVOD and T2 or T3 type atomizers look very similar in shape and material but looking closely you will see they do not have those white strings on either side, instead they may have a tiny cylinder looking long metal tube from top to bottom.
The way these two devices work are very different, the CE4 or similar type atomizers pulls the e Liquid through the long strings of wicks towards the top, while the EVOD type has these tiny but visible wicks that are at the base of the core where the heating elements are located. So in other words CE4 works pretty much the opposite way as the EVOD does. You fill the CE4 from the top while you fill the EVOD from the bottom holding it upside down.
The prices are very similar for both atomizers, you may find EVOD and T2 or T3 going for little higher (Average about $3-$5) when the CE4 average price is around $2-$3 depending on where you buy them from. Remember not all CE4 or EVOD are created equal. The quality, looks even shapes can vary widely along with price. There are over 400 e Cigarette manufacturers only in Shenzhen, China which also means there are at least that many variation in quality and looks. Since there are no set standards for these devices, every other company tries to get creative in designing and building these devices and they all have a mini R&D department in each factory.
I brought with me 7 different kinds of CE4 and around 9 different kind of EVOD/T2/T3 type atomizers when I was in China a month ago. I picked them from 4 different companies. To my surprise they did vary widely in every aspect. They did not even look exactly same, though with CE4 most of them had somewhat close similarities but the vaping experience was very different from one to the next. Out of 7 CE4 only 2 were decent and one was great. The rest didn’t create enough vapor to satisfy my thirst or gave me some burnt after taste. Remind you I used mostly pg based liquid as I remembered VG(thicker) type e liquid does even worse with these type of atomizers.
But surprisingly out of the 9 EVOD type atomizers 7 did great while the other 2 did okay but better than the best performing CE4. The best part of these atomizers are the way you can just change the core and it becomes all new again. These atomizers all have a core that is very easily changeable and they are cheap (Around $1.50-$2). If you use thicker VG based liquid that are darker in color than your core will not last more than a week. But if you use lighter color (Vg/PG mix), expect your atomizers to last about 2 weeks.
You can clean these cores by holding them under warm water for a few minutes while gently rub the wick part on each side to get the gunk out. Once you wash it, blow through them and shake them well so all the excess water of out than leave them around the window so they can dry for a day or two. This works well and gives them an extra week of life, but in my testing you can only wash them once or at most twice, after than the quality of vapor goes downhill.
One important reminder about battery cleaning, make sure to clean and dry the battery thread and inside the thread as 99% atomizers do leak a little juice here and there. For safety and for best vaping experience always clean the battery thread and inner side of the thread, in my experience Q tips work wonder. Make sure to clean them before you put them in charge and clean them each time you refill those cartomizers and atomizers. Enjoy and try the different E-Cig type of atomizers!
I would love your feedback and thoughts. Please post your advice and comments as it will help me improve this blog.

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LOL at you
St. Louis, US
Nov 08, 2013 8:26 pm EST
Verified customer This comment was posted by a verified customer. Learn more

You can reach Mr. Paramore directly at [protected].

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Duke of Roofing
St. Charles, US
Aug 19, 2013 3:04 pm EDT

I own a GC firm here in the St. Charles/St. Louis area and Bolt tried to advised my client that his old roof needed replacement and they could get it paid for by his insurance company. My client advised him it was 2 weeks old. They walked away.

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JonParasite
, US
Jul 13, 2013 4:09 am EDT

Jon Paramore promised the world to a company based out of Iowa. He came in as a highly recruited, undercover snake. He came across as a Christian, honest hard working manager. He promised to build the company into a 50M a year outfit. He was reasonable in the first few months (he was a snake) once jobs came pouring in... He opened an alias business account under the same name so he could cash insurance checks. He has all of his "followers" come with him from the last company he scammed. Olneya construction out of Missouri. He made sure his accounting people handled all the money flow. Once he felt like he had control of the office "hitler" or "Jon parasite" started to fire loyal workers who fought hard to build the honest roofing brand (based in iowa, a company ill leave out) he continued to manipulate and steal from the company. The owner who was trusting and smart realized he was being taken advantage of filed a comlplaint and hired lawyers. Jon writer a letter of resignation left the company with over 250k of stolen money. Now he is taking advantage of a new company "bolt restoration" beware of doing business with this snake. Let this be a warning to all

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Jparamore11
Saint Louis, US
Apr 12, 2013 7:45 am EDT
Verified customer This comment was posted by a verified customer. Learn more

People like you disgust me as well. You are an absolute coward to hide behind some childish blog. Real people worth any grain of salt would confront me face to face if they really took issue with anything I was doing. The problem is you, just like every other person who has written on this thread, are an insecure, unintelligent, worthless piece of garbage who try's to slander someone whom you have likely never met or know anything about.

GROW UP! Everyone who is anyone in business has failed before. The difference is I admit I have failed but I continue to move forward. I am an extremely humble person with a fantastic group of supporters including friends, family, and coworkers.

You can judge me all you want. You can post things about me all day. No one on this blog or any other blog will ever be able to break my spirit or my drive. My job is to serve those in need and I have been doing so for years! If you want to know the story about the different companies I have owned, I'm happy to share them.

Stop being cowardly people. I'm a transparent person and I always have been. But if you continue to post falsities on this blog in attempt to slander me or deface me, you just continue to prove my point that you are a spineless coward with low self esteem who is unwilling to meet me face to face or contact me.

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Meatsuit
, US
Dec 04, 2021 5:14 am EST

Oh yes... such a humblebrag post with a slew of insults. Really proving your defense buddy. Sounds like an MLM scam everywhere I look.

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Concerned_citizen_hate_scumbags
Fenton, US
Apr 12, 2013 12:11 am EDT

Amazing how a guy gets away with scamming people, at least a 12court cases against Jon Paramore...and all different named companies...if your so great why the name changes? Why don't you pay your bills, Crown C/MVP Suppy all roofing supply houses this guy tried to scam. Prestige exteriors, legacy builders, roof one, olynea, & now bolt restoration.

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it must be a duck...why don't you keep the same name for more than a yr if your such an outstanding citizen? People like you disgust me!

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Jparamore11
Saint Louis, US
Apr 11, 2013 11:42 pm EDT
Verified customer This comment was posted by a verified customer. Learn more

There are no states attorneys looking for me and the only people that post on this are jealous haters. Again- anyone wishing to contact me knows they can email me at any time at jparamore77@gmail.com.

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Concerned_citizen_hate_scumbags
Fenton, US
Apr 11, 2013 11:25 pm EDT

This guy is back at it in St. Louis under a new name Bolt Restoration, what a ###.
Anyone needs help finding this guy: www.boltrestoration.com. If you google his name he has at least 3states attorney generals looking for him, this guy needs to be put in jail.
Bolt Restoration St. Louis. Bolt Restoration Bolt Restoration Bolt Restoration
Bolt Restoration Saint Louis Jon Paramore Jon Paramore. Jon Paramore
Bolt Restoration- Jon Parmore. Bolt Restoration Bolt Restoration
Bolt Restoration
Bolt
Roofing St Louis
St Louis Roofing
Restoration
Bolt Restoration
Roofing Contractors St Louis
### Stl Roofing Companies
Www.boltrestoration.com.

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jparamore77
New Orleans, US
Apr 09, 2012 4:54 pm EDT
Verified customer This comment was posted by a verified customer. Learn more

In addition, whomever eagleeyejoe is, you or anyone else can contact me directly anytime to discuss any issue you have or had with me. I am hiding from no one. Stop being a coward and using a public blog and instead, be a man or woman and handle things appropriately. You can contact me at jparamore77@gmail.com and give me your contact information and I am happy to contact you or anyone else anytime, if there is a real issue. Be respectful, have some courtesy, and stop being a coward in hiding behind a fake name on a childish blog.

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Concerned23
Maryville, US
Apr 06, 2012 11:00 am EDT
Verified customer This comment was posted by a verified customer. Learn more

To Whom It May Concern,

Jon Paramore is no longer employed by or associated with Olneya Restoration Group in any manner. On behalf of Olneya, I would like to send my deepest sympathies to all those affected by anything he may have done to former customers or employees. In no way should his previous actions be a reflection of Olneya's business practices. Mr. Paramore's behavior is not supported by Olneya and we sincerely hope resolutions have been made to all of you by him. As a BBB Accredited and award-winning company, Olneya does not condone this sort of professional behavior and we do not wish to be associated with it. For further information, please email info@olneya.com. We would be happy to ease any concerns you may have regarding Olneya and this matter. Thank you and I wish you all the best.

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eagleeyejoe
Houston, US
Oct 03, 2011 7:00 pm EDT

http://olneya.com/

View 0 more photos
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eagleeyejoe
Houston, US
Oct 03, 2011 6:52 pm EDT

Jon Paramore is hiding in plain sight now, working for OLNEYA Restoration Group in the St. Louis Area. They are extremely wary of people who call for Mr. Paramore, since he's hiding from the many disgruntled customers from his former escapades in the Houston area. You can call and inquire of the new company, formerly AGC at [protected] or try this link for more info. http://directory.thetelegraph.com/listings/7802736/St-Louis-Roofing-St-Louis-Home-Remodeling-AGC-Contracting-LLC

Don't expect to talk to Mr. Paramore, since he's still in hiding, but that's where he's hidden himself. I will try to keep track of this guy until he steps up and takes some responsibility for the wake of destruction and fraud he's left behind him. Consumers in St. Louis need to be aware that this new enterprise (OLNEYA or AGC or PCG) is harboring a "scam artist". I wouldn't give them the time of day, much less let them do work for me. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

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Martha Q
63304, US
Oct 17, 2010 9:42 am EDT

I told

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CfromTX
desmoines, US
Sep 25, 2010 8:50 pm EDT

First of all it is fraud/crime for any homeowner to profit from Insurance proceedes.How can a homeowner call a salesman a crook/cheat if that homeowner is looking to cheat/steal from the Insurance companies.Many homeowners do not understand this.It is in the homeowners and salesmans intrest for thier job to be done the right way. Good communication and understanding will help both parties to achieve.

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CfromTX
desmoines, US
Sep 25, 2010 8:39 pm EDT

First of all.Its is a crime/fraud for the homeowner to profit from Insurance Proceedes. If the homeowner intendes to profit from an insurance claim, then how can he say that a salesman is a crook and a cheat when he himself is looking to cheat the Insurance company. Many homeowners do not unserstand this. Clear communication with the homeowners help them to understand that, it is in the intrest of the homeowner for thier job to be done right, as well as the salesman.

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DAGCO
Denver, US
Sep 02, 2010 8:54 pm EDT
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Brian, Brian...Brian
This is you worst nightmare I see I am not the only one you have successfully SCREWED. Here is my deal the internet is a very powerful tool, you pay me what I am owed and I go away, You decide not too and I pop up every opportunity and tell my story.

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brimr
ofallon, US
May 03, 2010 2:36 pm EDT

Mr. Wadsworth,

This was brought to my attention. I am very sympathetic to your outstanding issues. I want to first clarify the air that I had no part or ownership in the Legacy Builders company I was only a employee/consultant for the owner Jon. I have tried to right many of the wrongs that were done to many people. I myself was left with an outstanding bill due to me for services rendered. In fact you have responded to me on this site regarding locating him. Please feel to contact me directly with any that you feel I maybe able to help you with. My door is always open. Unfortunely there was a wake of diappointment left behind myself included in the aftermath of Houston. I assure none of it was my doing. I have contacts to the investor that Jon used and screwed for hundreds of thousands. Paragon has no conection what so ever with Legacy or Jon. If i find him I have something special for him. Lastly, please reframe from making false statements regarding Paragon. I would request that you contact me and speak with me and post a positive response back on this site. I have not made any bad practices or screwed anyone over and I assure you all repairs that are needed have and will always be repaired. I stand behind my warranties.

Sincerely,
Brian Routt

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Mr. Wadsworth
Denve, US
Apr 16, 2010 6:23 pm EDT

Legacy Builder's USA must have changed it's name to Paragon Builder's USA. Brian Routt of Missouri is still involved. I hope anyone on this site would contact the Missouri Attorney General's Office concerning Brian Routt and his companies. They promise to do the work for the insurance estimate and refuse to make any repairs to make the structure to code, or repair leaks, and later plaster damage. Paragon Builders USA "owned by Brian Routt, " of O' Fallon Missouri, screwed over numerous customers in Arvada, Colorado.

Mr. Wadsworth

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wwjd_316
Houston, US
Sep 28, 2009 9:50 pm EDT

I would love to know where he is. Can you please contact me via email and I will forward you my personal information so that you can have your attorney's contact me!

Thank you!
wwjd_316@live.com

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jgs
Houston, US
Sep 28, 2009 6:45 pm EDT

All parties that have had problems with Legacy please respond here with your emails. Myself and a few others have been successful in tracking down Mr. Paramore. Our attorneys have joined up together and we will be taking him down. We have several past employees that will testify in court of what went on and the illegal acts performed by Jon Paramore. Our attorneys have found out that even his investor is sueing him for 10's of thousands of dollars. He has filed bankruptcy to try and get out of this. Our attorneys said that does not matter. We will be filing criminal charges. He has scammed and lied to everyone. He will not get away with it. Post your emails here and i will have the attoneys get in touch with you and take your statements. This WILL be going to court.

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Jon Paramore
St. Louis, US
Sep 15, 2009 11:43 am EDT

Good one...

Anyone who feels like he or she has been taken advantage of can contact me any time via email @ jonp@legacybuildersusa.com. If there is real and just cause, and your case is not in any kind of dispute or litigation, I will do my best to make restitution, if that is what needs to be done.

There are/were a total of 4 clients of Legacy's where contracts or refunds were in question. 2 of those have now been resolved and the other 2 will be resolved shortly.

Again, anyone who reads this blog or feels as though they have been wronged by Legacy or any of its members, please contact me directly via email. Those of you, and you know who you are, who have legitimate contracts or disputes will be restored.

Again, feel free to contact me via email so that we can come to a real resolution. Bashing people on a complaint board and posting heresay is not going to accomplish anything. IF there is a dispute to be resolved, as adults, we can work it out.

Sincerely,
Jon Paramore, Member
Legacy Builders USA

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Scammer11
Houston, US
Sep 14, 2009 11:35 pm EDT

Jon Paramore is the biggest scam artist out there. He is another bernie madeoff. He has stolen more than $400, 000 from clients and Investors. He Has stolen from employees and sub contractors. He tells one lie after another to everyone. Cheats on his wife with employees. I encourage everyone to continue to call the attorney general office and have him put in jail for fraud. If we don't keep Persueing him he will get away with it.

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anti legacy
Tomball, US
Jul 24, 2009 8:55 am EDT

To the pro LEGACY on here. You are all lieing through your teeth and you know it. You are no longer a member of the BBB, have disconnected your numbers, and are refusing to reply to emails and voicemails at the St. Louis number. This is not childish as people who have posted here have run out of options trying to reach Legacy or even get a respo nse from Mr. Paramore. You have been outed by several of your employees other than Mr. Gautier. This will continue and all the com plaints I have personally made will continue. To anyone who reads this contact the attorney generals office imediately. And we all have no choice but to go from there...

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JHH
Houston, US
Jun 10, 2009 12:30 pm EDT

Jon Paramore,
We have scheduled and re-scheduled over and over again. Presumably to exchange the refund for the paperwork that you requested from me. I have been side stepped once again today. When i posted last time you responded very quickly so i am using this venue again.
Please get in touch with me and let's complete this refund process.
By the way, if any of you staunch Legacy supporters: Jeff, Legacy member or "truth" (thats a good one!) know how to contact Jon by phone, email or mail service or get any of their so called office numbers to pick up, i would appreciate any information you can provide.
Thanks.
JHH

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truth
, US
Jun 09, 2009 9:22 am EDT

the afore mentioned description of walter (joe) gautier is spot on. He is a con to the core. Legacy Builders is just one of many who have fallen victim to his lies.

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Jeff
Jacksonville Beach, US
Jun 03, 2009 3:34 pm EDT

Well, I guess it has reached the point on this goofy site, where someone with some intelligent insight step in and comment...

Lets address these issues one at a time shall we!

Starting with the person who started this complaint blog in the first place...

Mr Walter (Joe) Gautier is a disgruntled employee of Legacy. Mr. Gautier is a bit of a "mother goose" story teller. He loves to embelish and lie to people to get them to pay for his jaded consulting services. He then bills them an outlandish amount of money, to which he says, are construction consulting fees. He is a liar and a swindler and if you have ever met the man, has a horendous hair cut. He is the poster child for a "shady salesman."

Now, lets address some of the other people who posted...

Trying to crush a legitimate company on a blog website is not only childish, but humorous. Do you people really think that getting on a bashing website is going to keep people from doing business with this company? I know Mr. Paramore (for those of you who can't spell his name correctly) personally. He is a man of integrity and is a man who has completed over 500 construction projects in Houston alone since October of 2008! Could any of you on this blog even manage that kind of volume?

Come on people, GROW UP! If you have a legitimate complaint about something he or Legacy is doing, file a complaint with the BBB. You will notice, to this day, there are 4 complaints out of over 500 customers they have done business with. THAT IS IMPRESSIVE! And, furthermore, they are all from people who have CANCELED their contracts after the 3 day right to recision clause.

So, in short... for those of you who come across this blog, who are really concerened about Legacy, call them or email them. It is true, you may get their message system, but not because they are not answering, but because they are busy handling the large volume of calls they are receiving.

Thank you for reading this,
Jeff Braswell, G.M. for Legacy- Jacksonville, FL

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JHH
Houston, US
Jun 03, 2009 3:12 pm EDT

Another comment to "Legacy member". You suggest we call the office for references of satisfied people in Houston. Why don't you give out a number that actually works? a number that is answered by a person and not a voice mail. I challenge you to do that. I have not tried the Austin office yet but will do that now in hopes of reaching SOMEONE! Jon is ducking my phone calls and emails. You way of doing business leaves a lot to be desired.

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JHH
Houston, US
Jun 03, 2009 3:06 pm EDT

I have requested a refund from Legacy Builders USA and they have given me the run around for over 30days. Their reasons for not refunding are incorrect and now i can not reach Jon Parramore by phone or email.
If they do refund my money I will gladly return to this site and proclaim that but i don't have much hope of that happening right now...
Come on Jon...prove me wrong sir!
I will be the first to apologize as i deposit the money that is rightfully mine.

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T.R.
Humble, US
May 28, 2009 12:31 am EDT

We completely disagree...

We hired Legacy to come to our home and deal with our insurance company. We had never been through this process. Not only were they exrememly helpful, they did exactly what they said they were going to do.

I would say, to anyone who thinks otherwise, keep your comments to yourself. These gentleman know exactly what they are doing and exactly how to do it.

Keep up the great work Legacy!

T.R.
Humble, TX

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Dissatisfied Customer
, US
May 27, 2009 4:38 pm EDT

I agree 100% with Joe Gautier. We were a customer of Legacy Builders and were "taken for a ride" by them. We were told the same thing about a "contingency contract" and "little or no money out of pocket" only to find out otherwise once we received our check from the insurance company. The lies start with the President of the company.

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Legacy Member
Houston, US
May 11, 2009 4:27 pm EDT

You will notice from Mr. Gautier, or Walter, as he is known, that not only is his English poor, but he clearly was a disgruntled and terrible sales person.

Mr. Gautier falsified documents to earn the sale of homeowners. But, when perfomance became an issue, he left our company and left us holding the bag.

I would urge anyone who reads this to call our office and ask for references. We have hundreds in Houston alone. Furthermore, feel free to talk to customers that started working with him and who were lied to by him.

We perform. We have too. Unlike Mr. Gautier, we do not run away from people with issues.

God Speed-
A member of Legacy!