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Bankcard Empire/United Business Solutions / Services not as described no refund

1 1928 E Highland Ave Ste F104 #012Phoenix, AZ, United States Review updated:
Contact information:
Phone: 877-227-3597

I was contacted by phone late Thursday afternoon and gave my credit card number for what sounded like a legitimate business proposition.

When I checked into the company it was obvious that what I had agreed to was not what they had stated so I called back the next day to cancel but was unable to reach them until Monday.

The person I spoke to said that he would terminate the agreement and I would get a refund.

When I called the next day to the service number I had been given to confirm the cancellation they said they had no record of it and would get back to me in 48 hours.

When they didn't call back in 48 hours I tried again to reach them they said again that they would get back to me.

They finally called back on the following Monday and they said that I had agreed to their no refund policy and I would not get a refund unless I advertised for a year.

I had not opened the package they sent me and said I would return it unopened to which he stated that they didn't want it back and it wouldn't make any difference.

The package contained a few cards, a CD training manual, an invoice (with a copy) from a different company(United Business Solutions - different address too) showing a payment of $350. requesting a signature agreeing to no refund under any circumstances and an affiliate agreement with terms and conditions that I had not agreed to.

I had stated in the original phone conversation that I agreed only if everything that they told me was true and was given the impression that only after I reviewed the material they sent and signed the invoice and returned it that the contract would be binding.

I called several times to the sales department that had originally called me and spoke to several different people who stated that they would look into it and see if they could do anything but nothing ever happened.

No ethical, reputable company would operate in such a manner and have a nonrefundable policy.

I am filing a dispute with my credit card company and a complaint to the Better business Bureau and to the Attorney General's Office in Washington State.

What an ordeal.

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Comments

  • Cm
      24th of Nov, 2008
    0 Votes

    I agree with your comments. Unfortunately I fell in the same trap. I also called to cancel, and they gave me truoble about giving my refund back. I haven't even received anything yet from them, and told them when I receive what they were sending me, that I would be sending it back, because I wanted to cancel. They gave me so much trouble about how I was to still work a year before getting anything back, even though I hadn't received the package yet that was to be send out. The still insisted that I work the business for 12 months, then I would get my money back. I'm still trying to get my money back. I found out that you have to make an additional investment on advertising, and that's more money that don't have to be wasting on this busness that I didn't know that I had to do. This turned out to be a scam. I will also be reporting this to the Better Business Bureau.

  • Br
      15th of Dec, 2008
    0 Votes

    My mentally disabled friend was recently ripped off for over $5, 000. They won't even respond to her written request for a refund other than try to tell her how it is great, have missed multiple appointments to discuss a refund and will not refund anything.

    Who are they?
    These guys are doing business under a lot of different names, but they all come back to one thing - they are trying to rip you off:
    Bank Card Empire
    Ultimate Business Solutions
    AIG Promotions
    HBO Media
    Edgemont Productions

    #1 Evidence that they are a SCAM

    First of all let's think about their offer. They want you to be an affiliate to refer people to sell their merchant account products. Take a look around at affiliate programs out there. The legitimate ones don't charge you $500 for the opportunity of referring people to them. That is ridiculous and should warn you right away that something is wrong. The website that they are selling you is a replicated website which means it is useless in the search engines and is just a copy of the same thing they give everyone else - they call it 'your' website but it is just their website with your affiliate ID. Legitimate affiliate programs don't charge you to link to their website as an affiliate.

    Second they will try to convince you to pay them to market their own product for you. Does that make any sense at all??? If they were making money by marketing their product why would they cut you in? They wouldn't!!

    Here's an example. Let's say I have a business selling merchant accounts. And I make phone calls on the telephone to sell my product. Let's say I make an average of $3 per call. Would I turn around and tell you I would call those people on your behalf for $2 per call? Of course not! I would want to keep the $3, not share it with you. However let's say I make less than $2 per call - say $0 per call. In that case I would sell that to you all day. Think about it! Them charging you for them to do their marketing for their company is obviously wrong. If they were making money on those leads why would they sell them to you instead of use them themselves? The obvious answer is that they aren't making money on those leads and they know perfectly well that you won't either! (Of course once it a while someone will make money, but the VAST majority will lose money.)

    When I called in they told me that if I spent $5, 000 that I would make $2, 000 per month forever and would turn a profit on the original $5, 000 within 2-3 months. This is FRAUD. They know perfectly well that this won't happen. If it did, they would spend their OWN $5, 000 and not MY $5, 000 to turn their own profit in 2-3 months. Ask them what percentage of people who buy make a profit. Either they will lie to you or they will deflect the question or say they don't know. (They could know - they just don't want to know.) My guess is that it is well under 1% of those who sign up who make money.

    Look around online. You will see a LOT of evidence that A) People aren't making money, B) they won't give you a refund.

    Here's how they work:
    They get your name as a lead from somewhere indicating that you want to own a business or make money from home. They have several reseller companies some of which as far as I can tell are Ultimate Business Solutions, AIG Promotions, Edgemont Productions, etc. I couldn't figure out for sure how they all fit together but you can know you are part of this same scam if you hear any of those names. Unfortunately, eventually they will change their names to something else because of all of the bad press.

    The bottom line is that their REAL business is not selling merchant accounts, their real business is selling their SCAM to you.

    Other things of interest:
    Bank Card Empire currently has an Unsatisfactory report with the Better Business Bureau and has 76 complaints! That is a lot of complaints for a small company! According to the BBB the business owners of the company are:
    Mr. Michael Malkin, Secretary / Treasurer
    Ms. Danielle Ashrafi, Director / VP of Agent Relations
    Mr. David Mersky, President
    Mr. David Weaver, Vice President

    They currently have 2 lawsuits pending - 1 in MI and 1 in AZ filed against them - both for fraud. (From what I can tell the principle owners seem to live in MI but the company is based in AZ - there is also some indication that they are based in Houston, TX).

    Look around on the web - there are lots of other sites with complaints about them other than just [redacted].

    So if you haven't bought yet - DON'T. Hopefully you are one of those wise enough to do a little research and realize this is a really bad idea.

    #2 If you have been taken in, what can you do to fight them?

    So let's say you have bought and realize that you made a big mistake. Whatever you do don't just be intimidated and walk away. That is what they are counting on you doing!!! They call it breakage and make a lot of their money because people are just passive and scared and don't do anything when they get ripped off. You need to do something. If not for yourself, then for the thousands and thousands of other people who they are ripping off. (I got involved with investigating them because they ripped off my neighbor who is mentally disabled and living in poverty and still they won't refund her.)

    Here are things that generally work and don't work:

    Do's

    1) File a chargeback through your credit card or credit cards that you purchased with. This is the #1 most important thing to do. First it means you might get your money back. Second, it HURTS THEM. You see the bank that provides their merchant account watches to see how high of a risk they are. The more chargebacks they get (whether you win the chargeback or not) the higher risk the bank considers them. If they get enough chargebacks, eventually the bank will freeze their money, stop doing business with them and possibly even puts them on something called the TMF making it almost impossible for them to get a merchant account anywhere. The bank will take a reserve out on them depending on how many chargebacks they get - hurting their cashflow and ability to scam more people. Also if they get more than 100 chargebacks in a month they get on the watch list with Visa & Mastercard - something VERY expensive for them. If you have Discover make sure that Discover knows what they are all about and they will probably eventually take away their Discover account completely - Discover is aggressively avoiding merchanting these type of companies.

    By chargeback I mean call your bank that you have your credit card through and ask to chargeback (get your money back) - have them use the reason code not as described because they promised you income you didn't receive. Or if they charged you more money than they told you they would, charge back using the fraud reason code. (Mostly explain to the person at the bank the details of how you were ripped off and they will help you out. If one rep isn't helpful try another until you find one that is sympathetic to you.)

    2) If they fight your chargeback and win, chargeback again! This is super important. First, you have a better chance to win the 2nd chargeback than the 1st. Second, it counts against them twice!! So their bank looks at them as being twice the risk - if they got you for $5, 000 and you chargeback twice the bank looks at it as $10, 000 in chargebacks so you get to do double the damage! Eventually they will have to stop fighting chargebacks because if they don't they will lose their merchant account.

    3) File a complaint with the Arizona Attorney General Consumer Protection division. The Attorney General's office is the one legal entity that can get to these guys - they have the ability to fine them, shut them down, and even put them in jail. It's their job. You can search online and find the website and file a complaint right online. Be sure to have as much evidence as possible of fraud. What is most important is to provide as much documentation as possible as to how they Misrepresented what they sold you - things like they told you that you would make money in a certain time-frame and then you didn't. In any case, file the complaint. The attorney general's office will pay attention to the volume of complaints - the more complaints they get the more aggressively they will go after them.

    4) File a complaint with the Attorney General's Office / Consumer Protection Agency in your state. Most states won't do much but some states have very strict telemarketing laws that they will go after them for. If you live in Kansas definitely file with your state, because they probably aren't in compliance with the 7 day written right to refund.

    5) File a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. This makes their count of complaints go up at the BBB. It also takes them hours to respond to the complaint. Once the complaint is closed with the BBB (the BBB won't actually do anything) refile the complaint with more information. Once that closes refile again and again until the BBB won't refile it. Each time you do this, they have to spend a bunch of time responding to it and the BBB complaint count goes up.

    6) Post on places like [redacted] and other similar websites on the Internet. Be heard and tell your story. You may provide evidence for lawsuits - you will definitely hurt their reputation causing other people to not buy from them and to get their money back.

    7) Be persistent on the phone with them. Every time you call in and argue with them about a refund you are costing them money. Don't give up. They have everything to lose. Not everyone at their company is dishonest, perhaps we can convince some of them to go find a job working for an honest company. You have nothing to lose - they already have your money.

    8) Be creative. There are probably a lot of other things you can do that are perfectly honest and legitimate that will cost them money to keep your money that they should be returning to you.

    Things that aren't all that effective.

    1) Going to a lawyer or threatening them with a lawyer (unless you have a brother or uncle that will do it for free.) Let's face it - you probably don't have a spare $20, 000 for the first round of taking them to court.

    2) Going to the FBI, FCC or FTC. It's not what they do.

  • Ra
      27th of Jul, 2009
    0 Votes

    This is to inform anyone who is interested in this person's posts towards Bankcard Empire that JIM BURG...also known as Kevin O Brien, also known as Moses Henri...also known as Moses Patterson host of various aliases at no time worked for Bankcard Empire and was actually a person who has been making threats as a disgruntled employee due to what he felt is commissions due to him by a third party licensee marketing room. Mr Henri has made accusations sa ying he has bogus sales scripts, sensitive customer information and sales invoices however, he has produced nothing to date to prove these allegations to Bankcard Empire. We were very interested in what he had to say but did not present anything that he CLAIMED he had to date. Instead he chose to write farfetched accusations and acted as though he worked for Bankcard Empire and felt we owed him some form of compensation. Bankcard Empire wants to make it very clear that anyone in these forums who claims to have had a fraudulent experience with Bankcard Empire will be held liable and to date we have sent many liable letters to the persons listed on this forum. Some were smart enough to respond before being served. Thank You to the clients who took he time to let us hear them out and work with them and they have made their retractions. It is not our intent to send out liable letters but if a client will not cooperate and choses to make malicious posts towards Bankcard Empire, then we will prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. We will be providing a list of law suits and their respective case numbers for public view along with a history of what each client who chose not to cooperate with us was offered to help them. Bankcard Empire is the merchant services provider and not a sales marketing firm selling marketing tools which are offered by third party marketing offices who sell the home based business opportunity to be an affiliate of Bankcard Empire. Anyone who has received a letter from our company and has not responded or made their retractions of statements made towards Bankcard Empire is strongly recommended to do so. If 5 business days passes and we have heard nothing from you, we will move to the next phase of our process which is filing suit and holding any individual accountable for statements made towards BANKCARD EMPIRE. You can call us directly at 602-489-7200 ex 232 or 217 to let us know how we can help you or what specifically you want Bankcard Empire to help you with. Be prepared to give your full information and Customer ID number for verification due to the bogus comments and fake names posted in these forums .

  • No
      8th of Aug, 2009
    0 Votes

    Bankcard Empire corrected their phone number on their threat to sue me and Ray Petty called me.

    They are working to resolve this issue.

  • Cm
      14th of Aug, 2009
    0 Votes

    I want to retract the comments that I posted about Bankcard Empire, on 11/29/2008. I was wrong. I have a better understanding what the company is about, and I made a couple of statements that weren't true from not knowing fully what a great opportunity Bankcard Empire would have been for me and can be for others who want a really legitimate at-home based job. It can work for you, and there is no advertising fees attached to working this business. It is up to you and what you make of your business. I apologize to Bankcard Empire and the all of the employees involved, that help the people like me who want to make a great income from doing business with Bankcard Empire. It's worth a try, because you can truly become a success story like thousands of others that have and are working their businesses offered by Bankcard Empire.

  • Ch
      15th of Aug, 2009
    0 Votes

    Ms. C Malone:

    Ray either scared you to death or gave you a generous refund. You are really sucking up to them now.

    If it is so wonderful, why don't you give them another try? You are repeating their scam line verbatim.

    Whatever the case, I hope you got SOMETHING back out of your ordeal and I hope you have learned a costly lesson about responding to internet ads, TV & Radio ads. You will NOT like the results you receive. Have a great life.

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